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2012-02-22 at MIDNIGHT

Budget passed

By Jeff Labine, tbnewswatch.com
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City Manager Tim Commisso apologized to council Tuesday for leaving $7 million out of the municipal budget.

Administration admitted to the oversight when it failed to include funding for two new fire halls and the renovation of four fire halls to accommodate shared facilities with EMS to the $225 million city budget.

Council had unanimously approved that funding in January.

Commisso said administration was directed to include the $7 million for the shared emergency facility in the budget, but there was an oversight in sending a memo and it wasn’t included.

He said the funding would come from the city’s reserve fund and wouldn’t impact the budget.

“I acknowledge it should have been in the budget,” Commisso said during the budget meeting at City Hall.

“It wasn’t and it needs to be in the budget. It’s $7 million which $5.8 million is being recommended from the stabilization. It’s an appropriate use of the stabilization because it is a onetime expenditure.”

He said it was a timing issue because the budget booklet was being printed at the same time they were getting direction on what to do with the shared space.

Regardless of the reasons, Commisso admitted that they made the mistake.

“There should have been a memo,” he said. “There should have been something to accompany it on the basis that there was an approved motion. There wasn’t and we acknowledge that.”

Commisso added if they defer the matter to the 2013 budget then they won’t be able to approve the construction to go ahead this year.
Coun. Rebecca Johnson voiced her opposition to using the reserved fund and questioned the legitimacy of using the city’s reserve funds.

“We’ve been talking about this reserve fund for other areas that we didn’t want to use it for in these budget deliberations,” Johnson said.

“Now you’re suggesting this is what we will use this $7 million from. I don’t understand how you cannot do it for one thing and now we’re going to do it for this thing. We don’t have $7 million.”

Northwood Ward Coun. Mark Bentz said the matter was already voted on during a committee of the whole and that it was just an oversight.

“We already put the money in,” Bentz said. “What they are proposing is financing that doesn’t impact the tax rate because it is coming out of reserve. It is not going to impact the tax rate.”

Council then voted and passed the proposed budget. Johnson was one of the two who voted against the budget
She said they needed to look for more ways to be efficient with the budget.

“I have a real problem with the fact that we’re going to increase our staff by 24 people,” Johnson said.

“We are not taking staff away at the other end so I don’t think that’s appropriate at this time. I have no problem with the 1.5 per cent for infrastructure but I think 1.1 per cent or more for operations should not be happening. I feel very strongly that this community can afford those increases.”

She added that council has to ratify the budget before being implemented.

McKellar ward Coun. Paul Pugh disagreed and said it was a good budget.

“I’m going to support it,” Pugh said. “We’re getting a good bang for our buck. Our citizens are getting a lot.”

Before passing the budget, council discussed an $84,000 amendment to the budget. The funding would go to a number of organizations but ultimately, council voted to defer the matter until March 5.
Coun. Mark Bentz was against the amendment and said it would have increased the budget.

Mayor Keith Hobbs was also against the amendment and added he needed more information before he could vote.
Council will have another budget deliberation meeting on Wednesday.


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Comments

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tiredofbull$ says:
City Manager Tim Commisso has got to be let go, FIRED, we the city cannot have someone making $7 million dollar mistakes or oversights. Sure it is not going to affect the budget, but that means there will be $7 million less in the city's reserves. Everything he does has huge cost overruns and such and he never takes them into consideration before he recommends them to the city. I also cannot believe our councill is always okay with what he does. There is no accountability in city hall and we the taxpayer's end up paying more and more dollars for it in higher taxes. How many of you could make that kind of mistake on your job and not be fired or replaced.
2/22/2012 1:14:34 AM
nvjgu says:
We need new people running this town. People that know what it's like to live at the bottem. All the regular's need to be gone.
2/22/2012 4:54:14 AM
chezhank says:
A tax increase of 2.6% is pathetic.
While our "nightmare" claims it is a good budget compared to previous years,he neglects to mention that the federal gas tax funding for infrastructure is at $6.7 million,something that did not exist prior to 2005.
As for the $7.0 million for the firehall it was supposed to be $5.8 million net and to come in the capital budget,but they slid it in with no discussion as councillor Virdiramo pointed out and have it $0.0 net now after they had already ratified it.
I think they should rescind the original motion for $5.8 million net first and force a discussion on the firehall.
They should also restore $1.5 million of the federal gas tax going toward water this year and take it from the stabilization reserve fund,lessening the need of $2.5 million for the EIRP to only $1.0 million,lowering the tax increase.
This budget is so pathetic they have to increase taxes to offer tax and water credits so people can pay their tax and water bill!
God help us!
2/22/2012 5:26:42 AM
vimeo says:
Mr. Commisso, how do you forget $7million. If did that in the private sector you would be out the door.

Turf the clown.
2/22/2012 7:25:16 AM
macdaddy77 says:
Love the picture of Foulds, he looks like he is trying to look interested or is literally losing his mind.
I expect nothing else from Mr. Pugh but a "I think its a good budget and the people are getting a lot." A lot of what? Increases?

Johnson does make a point of why the need to go into the fund for this and not for others but after the mistake, it certainly would not be fair to add it to the budget. So both sides have an argument.

Then there is numb nuts Commisso, again, how much do I need to stress that he needs to go.
I am surprised he did not bring up the reserve fund needed for the new multi plex project.

My friend and I are designing t-shirts and will sell them in front of city hall once we get them printed and ready for sale.
They will come in two forms, RISE ABOVE TAXES and RISE ABOVE COUNCIL.
Be sure to get yours. $5 each in all sizes available. Free WWE ice cream bars for the kids too.

Wake up people and stand up.
Taxes are due in early March, lets not pay them.
2/22/2012 7:47:31 AM
Chaos says:
Most people if they make a 7 million dollar mistake at work get fired. At city hall you just call it an oversight and say sorry and its all ok...don't worry taxpayer got your back.

TBnewsatch please report how much money in this budget was taken from the reserve / infrastructure fund. How can councillors say it won't effect the tax rate??!! These people are bankrupting the future tax base of Thunder BAy...
2/22/2012 8:03:03 AM
yqtyqt says:
I would like to see the wording in the bylaw when the stabilization reserve fund was created. I don't think it covers one time errors like the one that has occurred here. If the wording isn't specific on this expenditure, then the spirit of the bylaw is being violate, and councillors are guilty of wrongfull use of public funds.

Who in administration takes responsibility for this action. There is enough high priced help in city hall that these things shouldn't be happening. So who Mr Commisso takes the fall for this? You, your treasurer, your clerk. Who? And what price will they pay?

You can call the use of the reserve fund whatever you like, but it's still depleting the precious and scarce resources that taxpayers have paid for at one time or another.

If money is that easy to find, then I don't want to hear about the infrastructure deficit anymore.

I think some answers from Council and Commisso are in order here.
2/22/2012 8:15:10 AM
DougMyers says:
Using the reserve fund is simply hiding budget increases to make it appeare more palatable.

What a disgusting display from administration!
2/22/2012 8:15:34 AM
Delbert Grady says:
Well thats the first time I agree with Pugh. He said he thinks citizens are getting "a lot".

We are getting a lot. A lot of BS from these clowns.

Johnson is almost comical, if she wasnt such a poor actor. She's been all for taking us down these paths, but now that the writing is on the wall, she's tried to run around saying "I told you this was a bad path to go down".

Rebecca, youve always been a big part of the problem.

One last question.. does anyone else see the simple pattern with our city? They always vote in favour of more spending and the only time they vote against ANYTHING is for things like cutting their travel budgets.

While the rest of the world is in cutback mode, our council still havent joined present day reality. They are so far behind they think they're in front.

We're in bad shape and every day Im getting closer to selling my properties to head for a township that hasnt yet gone insane.
2/22/2012 8:31:40 AM
arjay says:
$7,000,000.00 oversight? AH WELL! just take it out of the surplus? i guess that could mean , this administration has a SURPLUS? and yet, they say water rates must go up, Hydro rates must go up.I have a feeling, that our all knowing Council should be considering getting rid of our SURPLUS administrators!! and then, getting rid of 4 or 5 SURPLUS councilors !!
we (the citizens) , are being Bushwhacked! no pun intended!
2/22/2012 8:42:29 AM
Lakeheader says:
What happened to Keith Hobbs saving the city? First he was going to get crime under wraps, that didn't happen. Now the budget is as out of control as the Mac's robberies!
2/22/2012 8:52:04 AM
paystar says:
like this city needs 24 more people on the payroll to do nothing!what a joke!
2/22/2012 8:53:12 AM
Delbert Grady says:
Ive been saying Commieisso is incompetent all along.

We cant afford his failures any longer. He needs to be dismissed now.
2/22/2012 9:25:35 AM
yer joking says:
What's all the fuss about? Everybody makes mistakes. Staff are busy,aldermen have visions of travel running through their heads and Mr Comiszar is trying to figure out if it was punched , drilled or Bored. Why just last week I over paid my taxes by $20,000 Did anybody get excited ? No they just accepted that we're all human. Like they say the fish stinks from the head and this one has been out of the water waaay too long. To those aldermen who read the budget line by line I guess ooops is all that can be said.
2/22/2012 9:29:43 AM
karcat says:
Mere Oversight??? Commiso Time To Go & The
Returned coucillors also,its taxpayers money . ty
2/22/2012 9:51:12 AM
homelessteen says:
I forgot to send the memo. I can't stop laughing. Thanks TBCC you guys should take your show on the road.
2/22/2012 9:55:30 AM
jimmyboy says:
Well once again watching all the action on channel 10 last evening the reserve funds were once again vandalized by various departments which was all promoted by city administration and then approved by our mayor and city council. With all the pilfering of funds and the creative accounting tactics...some one should have called the cops into play as well.
Tbnewswatch.com

2/22/2012 10:01:12 AM
yqtyqt says:
Well jimmyboy - you may not be far off.

As I stated above, the use of reserve funds is specific in the bylaws that they were created for. Nobody, including Council itself and administration has the ability to violate a bylaw. The wording of the purpose of the bylaw should be looked at closely. I'm curious if it states that the bylaw can be used for budget "oversights". Previous taxpayers have contributed to this reserve fund. It didn't exist by magic or money from the sky. It was all taxpayers money at one time or another.

I'm highly suspicious of what has happened here. If they have violated a bylaw, then the cops should be called.

In the very, very least, this is an abuse of administrative power. Commisso should be fired (and perhaps charged).

This is a very serious matter.
2/22/2012 10:34:24 AM
chezhank says:
2/22/2012 11:00:24 AM
chezhank says:
@yqtyqt
The stabilization reserve fund is an "operating fund",so you have a good point.
So they may have to take it out of the Renew fund which is a "capital fund".
The work on the BOM building in Victoriaville is also being funded from the stabilization reserve fund to the tune of $1.0 million+.
2/22/2012 11:32:43 AM
yqtyqt says:
Thanks chezhank.

However, the bylaw states the following "The purpose of a Stabilization Reserve Fund is to provide a source of funding in the event that uncontrollable or unanticipated costs or decreased revenues impact operating budgets."

In my interpretation, this doesn't fit the bill. There were no uncontrollable expenses or decreased revenues. Administration screwed up. Plan and simple. No small mistake aboutwhat happened here.

I would suggest that council now has the option of going back and cutting a similar amount from the budget.

But second of all, if administration has that much squirelled away then didn't they introduce it in the original budget to cut tax rates. Why does administration keep crying poverty when they have money that they can access when they have an "oversight".

Heads should roll over this one. Start at the top and work your way down. Someone should pay the price and dearly.

The new buzzword is accountablity. Now I want to see it in action.
2/22/2012 2:10:18 PM
chezhank says:
We all hear the mantra from councillors,"What the debt to reserve ratio" ....somehow that question was not asked last night..........will ask a deputant to ask it tonight!
Yes you have a chance to tell them what you think of the budget tonight.
February 22, 2012
Public Post-Budget Consultation Meeting at City Hall, Council Chambers, 6:30 pm
Bring rope!
2/22/2012 10:15:39 AM
panzerIV says:
Actually it was addressed. The city stated that it stood at 1.6 debt per 1 dollar in reserve funds which is down from 2-1 it was a couple years ago.
2/22/2012 11:31:05 AM
macdaddy77 says:
I don't see the point of going to a meeting.
Whatever the citizens say only falls on deaf ears or Mr. Bentz will simply cut people off and tell them they are out of order or don't know what they are talking about.
Not to mention Pugh, Virdiramo and Foulds as the council yes men.
Commisso made a serious error, his head is only going to get bigger and rounder.
Fire this man and fast before he sinks the people in this town into the small version of Greece.
Chez is right, bring rope and the real expensive one because their weight is great considering all the "stuff" they are full of.
2/22/2012 11:21:21 AM
kurtz says:
Actually the city is a lot worse now that Hobbs is the mayor. He thought of himself as the saviour. Crime is worse, taxes up. I know he only has one vote, but he presented himself as a better choice than Lynn. He is far worse.
2/22/2012 11:25:16 AM
DougMyers says:
Seriously?!?!?

Can you name just one thing that Lynn actually did HERSELF? Nothing, that's right nothing.

All she did was take credit for other peoples hard work!
2/22/2012 12:05:58 PM
yer joking says:
Well There you said it! At least she got somebody to work. More than these clowns have done.
2/22/2012 2:36:55 PM
SadButTrue says:
Her taking credit for someones work is something that she did accomplish. Not something to be proud of but an accomplishment. So far as of yet, Hobbs can't even claim credit to others work let alone his own.
2/22/2012 3:18:29 PM
Arch Stanton says:
If Commisso worked in the Private Sector, he would not be left in charge of the PETTY CASH!

'A $7.0 million OVERSIGHT??????'
'Thank-you Mr. Commisso. Your resignation is hereby accepted with immediate effect.'
2/22/2012 11:34:40 AM
panzerIV says:
For all those wanting to throwing people under the bus you might want to sure your throwing the right guy under. Mr. Alexander is the one which fire/ems and police fall under and he was the one championing this.

As much as you guys dislike Mr. Commissio the city doesn't have the money to cut him before his contract ends. We dont want a webster-ford mess on our hands.
2/22/2012 11:36:20 AM
yqtyqt says:
panzer - there's lots of people who should be thrown under the bus on this one. And lots of blame to hand out.

But the two that come to mind for me are Mr Commisso and Ms Busch. The CAO and the Treasurer are the two most senior staff with budgetary responsiblity. Both are professional accountants who should know better and both have the authority (and thereby the responsibility) to ensure that municipal finances are correctly stated.

In particular Ms. Busch has statutory responsibility under the municipal act irectly to the citizens. We're not talking about peanuts here. $7million. If this happens once in your professional career, it's too often. It's a poor reflection on her profession and sadly calls her work under the microscope.

This appears to be the blind leading the blind. If this can happen here, what else is going on that we don't know about.

Faith in administation becomes an issue which needs to be addressed.
2/22/2012 2:27:32 PM
Sandwiches1123 says:
The budget is missing a $7 million cost for the fire station/EMS facility upgrades? Bah, no worries. Just increase the water rates a little more to cover the cost.

Done and Done. Next item!
2/22/2012 12:24:18 PM
today says:
Another oversight that he missed was his letter of resignation.
The next oversight will be, the letter of agreement to have a multiplex built on the marina site before a hotel is built,that he signed, slipped his mind, and misplaced.
I would say that Commisso has had too many calculated, costly oversights in his office.
Just my opinion.
2/22/2012 12:45:52 PM
calvin15 says:
well...at least he didn't make the excuse he was on medication....had just worked 30 hours straight and doesn't remember...not that it makes it any better.
2/22/2012 3:36:39 PM
yqt says:
He said the funding would come from the city’s reserve fund.

Reserve fund? There shouldn't be a reserve fund. Every dollar of extra money should be put towards paying off the darn debt. If you can come under budget, get the old ax out and start chopping.
2/22/2012 1:42:02 PM
Delbert Grady says:
Bingo!

Governments should NEVER have a monetary surplus.

If they do, that means they're over taxing or over charging. Surpluses are guaranteed evidence of mismanaged affairs.

If the citizens dont have any money in the bank, why should their government?
2/22/2012 3:52:10 PM
yer joking says:
So is Mr Commissio saying there is more than one budget? The public budget and the stuff that is paid for from other accounts. Should this question not be asked for fear of opening the way for more silly questions? How manybudgets are there? Inquiring minds want to know. More budgets or agendas? Hmmmmm.
2/22/2012 2:46:41 PM
TBDR says:
it was already earmarked and accounted for. He forgot to put it in the final tally , but all of the numbers for 2012 accounted for it and the 7 million was approved by council in the fall.. It should have been no surprise to council, or to the armchair councilors who love to spew rhetoric on here.
2/22/2012 3:40:46 PM
chezhank says:
Pray tell where then....TBDRhetoric!
2/22/2012 3:51:58 PM
Slyder says:
^This. You do know that this money was discussed, approved and financed, right? You know how a budgeting process works, right? All this was was forgetting to put the number into the excel spreadsheet they gave to council, after it had been approved, discussed and financed. Talk about sensationalizing it for comments. Downvote for Tbnewswatch. Good for ad revenue though I suppose.
2/22/2012 4:24:16 PM
calvin15 says:
agree with you
2/22/2012 4:35:50 PM
chemtech says:
WOW Do you people actually know the facts or yall just like to complain. TBDR is correct and knows the facts. The budget booklet was drafted before council passed the recommendations in the Strategic Master Fire Plan. Tim Commisso wasn't hiding anything, someone in Admin forgot to attach a memorandum to the final copy to add this item that council unanimously passed. This money was already earmarked and wasnt just slapped on at the last minute and doesnt add an additional amount to the tax increase. IMHO Tim Commisso is doing an excellent job as City Manager and needs to be commended for stepping up and getting things done.
2/22/2012 4:38:46 PM
fluffy says:
This city is getting to expensive to live in. Shuniah or Oliver Paipoonge is starting to look pretty good. Of course the budget went through. Next year they could propose a 10% tax increase and no matter what us paying stiffs say, it'll go through to. I'm starting the think the people running this city need to be put on the first boat outta here in the spring.
2/22/2012 7:16:46 PM
tiredofbull$ says:
chemtech = take off your blinders and wake up and check out all the facts.

"City Manager Tim Commisso apologized to council Tuesday for leaving $7 million out of the municipal budget.

Administration admitted to the oversight when it failed to include funding for two new fire halls and the renovation of four fire halls to accommodate shared facilities with EMS to the $225 million city budget"

Plus what about all the cost overrun's at the marina, etc., etc.. Maybe you are Tim Commisso and just want to pat yourself on the back. Read all of the above comments and see what percentage think he is doing a good job. Maybe tbaynewswatch could use that for a poll question one day? Do you think Tim Commisso is doing a good job as City Manager?
2/23/2012 1:54:20 AM
chemtech says:
I watched the council meeting - did you? I know the facts. Admin didn't fail to include the funding to the budget, Commisso apologized for not sending a memo. He wasn't trying to hide the $7M from council, who unanimously passed the Master Fire Plan. All the above posts dont mean jack to me, its just comments from all the whiners on here that have nothing better to do than complain about everything. I don't see the other 99% of the citizens of T Bay circling City Hall looking to linch Tim and it tells me that most people are fine with the 2.6% increase. If your so tired of bull$, you have options - like move away!!
2/23/2012 7:04:00 PM
chemtech says:
All this complaining for 2.6% or $65 increase on the average residential property? For those who budget every penny they earn that buy 52 cases of brew a year - guess what - you can only buy 50 cases this year, unless of course, you got a wage increase.
2/23/2012 7:12:19 PM
chemtech says:
tiredofbull$ yeah lets do a poll of the Day for Tim Commisso so that 317 people can speak for 110,000 who don't care about a minor oversight such as forgetting to send a memo. Everyone makes mistakes. Tim apologized for someone in Finance who forgot. - DONE - so move on!! Let it go already!!
2/23/2012 7:19:01 PM
JerBear88 says:
7 million ,WOW. But a simple apology will be suffice.I guess now there won't be any money left to negotiate the contract of the city's inside and outside workers who have been with out a contract for 14 months already. I hope they walk out and see what reserve fund the city uses to keep my services going, I hope it's not the same fund the 7 million is coming from!
2/23/2012 7:26:55 PM
The Beaver..... says:
We really haven had a good Circus in the City for a long time..next one in will have Ice cream
without Global Sticks.EMS sure gave us all a finger...or not
2/23/2012 8:36:30 PM
The Beaver..... says:
“The days of markets tolerating government overspending are finished,” he said in his budget speech. “That’s the new paradigm.”
We the Tax Payers are the marked,our message to the City is the same as above.

2/24/2012 8:43:39 AM
tiredofbull$ says:
chemtech or should I just call you Tim Jr., yes we do have options, it is called FREEDOM OF SPEECH, I along with most taxpayers are tired of high taxes, watch the commercials where seniors are forced either to heat there homes or eat, not both, that is really happening. Sure it may only be $65 in property taxes but what about higher water rates, higher electricity rates, higher insurance rates (because all of the crime), etc., etc.. Wages are not increasing but everything else is = the more money going out for these types of expenses the less for other purchases which = less people working. Plus for your last comment on " DONE - so move on!! Let it go already!!, you must not be able to let it go because you responded 3 times in a row, 2 for sure to my last comment, so do not preach one to other's that you do not follow yourself.
2/27/2012 2:03:48 AM
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