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2012-09-20 at 13:28

Changing his mind

By Jeff Labine, tbnewswatch.com
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THUNDER BAY – The mayor, who recently declared to council that he didn’t like watching flowers grow, took time on Thursday to smell the roses.

Allergies kept Keith Hobbs out of the Centennial Botanical Conservatory, but after paying his first visit Thursday the mayor has had a change of heart about the facility’s closure.

The city closed the conservatory after reports came in that glass had fallen from the roof. Administrations recommended the city re-open the tropical display house to the public after install a $76,000, but keep the east and west wings closed.

Hobbs had walked in wearing a hardhat but was told he didn’t need it since the inspector had come earlier in the morning to ensure the building was safe.

Having toured the facility and seeing firsthand the supposed dangerous conditions, Hobbs said he’s changed his mind and will support keeping the conservatory open.

“I guess I should have come here as a child,” Hobbs said. “When staff tells me glass falls out not in, I’m concerned about all this hype on safety. I’m glad I voted against the $76,000 for the netting. I feel very safe in here.

“I have a lot of allergies and I had to take a lot of allergy medication today. That’s probably the only reason, probably not a good enough reason.”

Some councillors have argued the conservatory would be better suited at Prince Arthur’s Landing instead of being located off Dease Street. Hobbs said it’s not possible to have the conservatory there because of soil issues and drainage into Lake Superior.

Hobbs said staff told him that the conservatory wasn’t marketed properly.

“We have to figure out ways to make revenues on this,” he said.

“This looks like it could be a gold mine. I’m not going to vote to close this place. I would like to see this place fixed up and maintained properly. I would like to have a count of how many people utilize it.”

Hobbs added he also learned the marketing budget for the Conservatory is $52 a year.

Karen Nadeau has worked at the conservatory for the past 24 years and said there’s never been any falling glass that has come into the facility.

There were a few panes of glass that appeared to have started to slide off or cracked and one was broken completely.

Nadeau said sometimes with the heat the glazing that holds the panes together will slide down but on the outside. If it was winter, a worker would have had those windows repaired by now in order to keep the heat in, she said.

“You look at any greenhouse and they are all built the same way,” Nadeau said. “The way the panes are overlapped if they do slide, they are going to slide down. Never had we had glass fall in. I think that’s false like the sky is falling.”

Nadeau called the net a waste of money because the facility was safe and it would cast shadows on the plants.

Besides the falling glass, there have been other myths circulating such as the greenhouse turning up to the heat to melt off snow. Nadeau said that’s simply not true because they have fans that circulate the heat, which helps melt the snow off.

There’s no switch to turn up the heat, she said.

So far, only Hobbs has paid a visit to the conservatory but Nadeau said she’s been trying to get other councillors to come so they can have the same change of mind.

“I think they are short of money for the waterfront,” she said. “They have spent a lot of money up there and they are out of money. We have prime land and it was made for the conservatory. If they want a new one, build over if not just repair it.”

She added the last time the conservatory received major renovations was back in 2000 with only a few touch ups in 2005.


 

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Comments

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keiths31 says:
It hasn't been marketed properly in decades. As a kid we used to go there every year for field trips. Because it is tucked away, it is easily forgotten. Put some money into marketing it and people will go there. It is a great facility.
9/20/2012 1:36:10 PM
yoyoma says:
The Conservatory is a beautiful place, and so much to see that you don't normally see around here. I remember going when I was young and hope to be able to take my children as well.
9/20/2012 2:08:22 PM
commonsense says:
Hurray to our Mayor for actually GOING to the facility, and getting the story first-hand.
The City's report gave only the info they want Council to have, to lead to future closure of facility.
Why didn't City apply for gov't money that was handed out to fix up Centennial projects? Perhaps they wanted a big maintenance bill to prove it should be closed.

The $900K spend on the ridiculous beacons could instead have made this much-loved facility energy-efficient.

There are many opportunities to hold classes there for painters, learn to plant and grow bulbs, more events, some evening hours to allow more visitors.
Imagine the facility with lights at Christmas, roving carolers, hot cider.
I encourage other Councillors and some Admin. who have never visited to have their own tour, and imagine the possibilities!
The present location is also perfect for taking seniors, likely the most common visitors. The close parking is perfect, the waterfront just isn't right for this facility.
9/20/2012 2:15:38 PM
olive garden says:
i would like to see the Conservatory located at the Marina, iam sure it
would bring more people threw , and for drainage iam sure if it can handle the hotel and condos it could handle the Conservatory drainage aswell .
9/20/2012 2:45:30 PM
mysterybuff says:
This facility is a "hot house" operation...the waterfront is extremely cold in the winter time. Are you suggesting that this facility should only be visited in the other seasons? The City has not done its job in ensuring this facility has been maintained over the years. It's location is perfectly fine. The City has to spend some money on maintenance which has been lacking for years and do some marketing of the facility. I agree with Commonsense in how this facility could be used.
9/20/2012 3:13:23 PM
tbay99 says:
Tax and spend...Tax and spend...Tax and spend!

Golf courses
Waterfront construction
Insanely expensive "Art"
Splash Pads throughout the city
Sunshine list - insane city employed wages
Infrastructure
Multiplex
Conservatory

And the list goes on! This is a city of 100,000 people and we are throwing millions of dollars at everything and anything it is ridiculous! Taxes have been going up constantly for years now is nobody tired of it? Maybe for once we can actually CUT a non-essential service and save homeowners some money on their next tax bill.

...who am I kidding city council would never go for that.

9/20/2012 3:08:12 PM
sky high says:
Wayne, good thing you aren't running the city. We'd be one big garbage dump and all our citizens would be paying zero property tax. The council we have in place now is the best the city has ever had
9/20/2012 9:03:00 PM
GreenThumb says:
He's not talking about drainage pipes into the sewer system he's talking about ground seepage from fertilizers, etc. that may leach through the ground and into Lake Superior. Also, he was speaking about drainage as it pertains to the plants themselves with regards to the actual type of soil they to be planted in.
9/20/2012 3:23:34 PM
pippirose says:
I'm glad the mayor finally visited the Conservatory.
As for it being moved to the Marina--No!
Not everything needs to be at the Marina or downtown PA. We need to keep tourist spots spread throughout our beautiful city. There's already plenty of money put into the harbourfront. With good marketing, our other little gems will be discovered.
9/20/2012 3:52:59 PM
RealityCzech says:
Moving the conservatory to the waterfront is a ridiculous idea. Not EVERYTHING needs to be located in the downtown PA area. It is nice to spread things around so all areas of the city can benefit.
9/20/2012 4:12:06 PM
Chaos says:
"This looks like it could be a gold mine." If I wasn't sure before this does it. Mayor has zero business sense. To many years on the gov't tit to know what makes mone and what doesn't. SOS.
9/20/2012 4:28:18 PM
Steven says:
Sick of everything being at the marina. ENOUGH!

Did you know that Port Arthur and Fort William are both parts of the city?

Lets see...... Cascades, new events centre (we know its a done deal), marina park++++, boulevard lake, trowbridge falls, centennial park, hospital, university, law school, magnus, hillcrest park, new multi-use building at former hillcrest high, new french high school, golf courses..... I could go on and on. Its all on one side of the city.

The south side has lost practically every last thing they had, from the gardens which will close in not too long, to the municipal golf course. What is there left on the south side? Chippawa, and thats so far off that its really really in either side. Its way out on its own. What else is left? McVicars park? The track? Thats about it.

If you take away every last thing for people to do, guess what youth are going to get into? CRIME. Welcome to the south side of the city, just the way you built it with a new court.
9/20/2012 5:15:55 PM
brooky says:
As a south sider, I'd gladly have the attractions on the north side, along with the trash that goes with them. I can easily drive the 5 minutes to the entertainment side of town, if need be. I'm not really sure what your point was here.
9/20/2012 7:46:47 PM
sky high says:
Steven well what does all this tell you? If the south side seems to be fading away well this is just what economics is dictating. Should we spend millions on the south side when it's going down the drain? Should we keep golf courses open that aren't making money? No, we shouldn't. If the north side is where it's at, lets take advantage of it and be proud of what we've accomplished
9/20/2012 9:07:40 PM
The Beaver..... says:
The Mayor....and we used to think Walter Assef
was a Odball...
9/20/2012 5:31:55 PM
Kam River says:
The only people who are fighting to keep it open is the union with radio ads and lots of money.

The average Thunder Bay Citizen never goes there. It is a waste of money. They city has large legal bills coming with the flood law suit. The union is fight to save jobs not looking out for the citizen of Thunder Bay. Members of council are changing their minds because the Union and their children are phoning. The citizens of Thunder Bay expect them to do the right think and stop wasting money. NO ONE GOES THERE....
9/20/2012 6:09:38 PM
waterunderthebridge says:
There is nothing the matter with keeping the Conservatory. We need things like the community auditorium, canada games complex, golf courses.

What we dont need is a bunch of unionized members growing and planting bedding out plants and containers for city parks and gardens. That should be put out to tender each year. There are several cost efficient private facilities (Creekside, Trevisanutto, Van Der Wees,Landales, Bill Martins) etc etc that can do this job without expanding their operation and much more cheaply.

The conservatory needs to encourage benefactors, needs to apply for funding from other levels of government and other sources, needs to promote itself more but definitely should not be in the plant production business.
9/20/2012 7:09:15 PM
mikevirtanen1961 says:
The last time this came up, Administration asked the private facilities. None of them could provide the quantity and quality for any cheaper than the Conservatory's greenhouses could. And since staff are shared between both the production and public greenhouses, producing plants for the parks in-house actually decreases costs for the public facility.

There are cases where contracting out makes sense, but the math just doesn't support it in this case.
9/21/2012 12:57:45 PM
laurie says:
hmm.. The south side has...

Confederation College & Art Gallery
Northwestern Sport Hall of Fame
Old Fort
Silver Cities
Intercity Mall
Thunder Bay Museum
Outdoor summer pools
Golf Courses
Airport
Fort William Gardens
Kam River Heritage Park...

In my opinion .... I don't think it matters whether its north or south side.. as long as we have it..
9/20/2012 7:27:01 PM
wayne says:
On TBTV news it was reported that the annual amount spent on marketing the conservatory is $52.
9/20/2012 8:14:33 PM
Whodo says:
For those Councilors that feel the Conservatory belongs on the Waterfront NEWS FLASH not ever thing belongs on the Waterfront. The coldest, wind swept shore line in the Country, A GREEN HOUSE, give your head a shake.
Besides the 'NO PARKING' AVAILABLE is going to be a problem.
9/20/2012 9:01:20 PM
blue says:
If only we could get him to play a round at Municipal
9/20/2012 9:59:49 PM
nfa16 says:
I only have to say that the Conservatory's hours of operation weren't exactly ideal. Closing at 4?? I love love love the Conservatory, but I could rarely go because of the hours.
9/21/2012 6:34:09 AM
panzerIV says:
If they feel the building is best located on that item of land and administration seems willing to build a new one then why not.

Move the plants from the west wing then tear it down and rebuild it. Same for the center and east wing. They build ships in sections so why not apply the building technique to this.
9/21/2012 8:37:02 AM
daxxis says:
Frankly, I'm happy to read a story that a politician sought first-hand answers and decided to change his mind based on those answers.

Rare.
9/21/2012 9:50:48 AM
waterunderthebridge says:
Keep the conservatory open. Contract out the growing of the bedding out plants to the many other companies that are out there. Simple cost recovery solution. Having unionized city employees plant city gardens is ridiculous. That is probably the rationale behind the city closing the Conservatory in the first place.
9/21/2012 10:11:20 AM
Murray Copperbottom says:
Not enough bees at the conservatory. In fact, there aren't any that I know of. How do the plants stay alive? Where will the honey come from? How Much will it cost? Who knows the muffin man? I sure don't, but I'm sure he's a very nice person who would visit the conservatory if only Colonel Mustard was waiting there with a candlestick!
9/21/2012 11:14:18 AM
Chief says:
This city has to learn how to stop wasting $
9/21/2012 11:39:17 AM
jumpstartpc says:
I like pretty flowers, they make me feel "special."
9/21/2012 11:47:27 AM
daxxis says:
Frankly, I'm happy to read a story that a politician sought first-hand answers and decided to change his mind based on those answers.

Rare.
9/21/2012 12:06:28 PM
Lexie says:
City facilities should be affordable and accessible to ALL - the City should not be in the golf course business which essentially caters to the more elite.
The Conservatory is an important facility for EVERYONE and it seriously needs to be marketed to schools, business groups, local clubs, childrens groups etc. They should have a booth at The Wedding Show, Trade Show etc. The Chamber should hold one of its after-business functions there.
There are so many opportunities to make money from this facility! Let me manage it - trust me - in one year this would be a black line item in the city budget!
9/21/2012 1:38:50 PM
wayne says:
sky high, how does my statement of the reported claim about the annual marketing budget of $52 for the conservatory deserve your nonsensical response?
9/21/2012 2:29:08 PM
wayne says:
Lexie: "Let me manage it - trust me - in one year this would be a black line item in the city budget!"

LOL! thanks for the chuckle...perhaps you can raise $4 million for the DRF before the end of November, save RegenMed, resurrect Global Sticks and Tornado Medical while you're at it. TFF!
9/22/2012 2:01:45 AM
Pandora says:
There are numerous possibilities for making the Conservatory a more beneficial asset for the city. The Conservatory is under utilized and an advertising budget of $57. is beyond laughable.
There are an incredible number of talented and knowledgeable folks here in Thunder Bay that could and have made smart suggestions to ensure a practical and purposeful future for OUR Conservatory.

The present location is the right location.
Lets hope it gets reopened and everyone who hasn't or hasn't been in a long time gets a chance to visit again.
9/22/2012 2:51:40 PM
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