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2013-01-03 at 13:03

Unions react

By Jeff Labine, tbnewswatch.com
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THUNDER BAY -- Officials with teachers' unions say the Ontario education minister's decision to impose a contract is a huge political error.

Education Minister Laurel Broten announced Thursday that she will impose contracts on members of the Elementary Teacher's Federation of Ontario and the Ontario Secondary School Teachers' Federation.

The Minister will also repeal Bill 115, which she says has become a "lightning rod" for teachers.

“I would ask everyone, especially teachers, to look carefully at the agreements being brought forward today,” Broten said in a release posted on the minster’s website.

“Our teachers remain among the best paid in Canada and their benefits remain generous. Teaching continues to be a rewarding career for thousands of dedicated professionals, and we will continue to invest in young teachers and reward their academic achievements and experience."

All new contracts are retroactive to Sept. 1, 2012 and will expire on Aug. 31, 2014.

Ellen Chambers, Local president for Elementary Teachers Federation of Ontario, said the minister approached CUPE and the education president on Dec. 21, yet her own union was never invited to talk.

Chambers argues that the imposed contract leaves the union with few options as it strips the labour organization of its right to strike.

The only option available now appears to be through the ballot box if an election is called.

Chambers promised the union will prove to Broten that she has made a significant political misstep when that time comes.

“It’s not just our rights she’s trampled on,” Chambers said. “I have 76,000 members who have very long memories. She’s very skilled at the political spin. She keeps saying we weren’t willing to talk. That’s a categorical lie.”

Chambers points out that many of the accomplishments the province boasts about, including smaller class sizes, all day Kindergarten, were done through negotiation.

Chambers added she couldn’t go into any details on any further actions taken by ETFO.

 

 

 

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Comments

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gusto says:
So I guess it is about the money.
1/3/2013 1:23:36 PM
razor_burn says:
It always has been.
1/4/2013 9:59:49 AM
Escroft says:
Deal with it. You make enough that you don't need any more. The Government tried to bargain with you prior to Bill 115 and you kept slapping their offers back in their face. Then this bill comes around, and you go whining like a bunch of crybabies because you can't have the province cannot afford. Now with the forced contracts, this is what you get and you're going to like it whether you love it or not.
1/3/2013 1:56:28 PM
DRL1979 says:
You don't know what you are talking about. You say the government tried to bargain. How do you know that? Because that's what the media reports. That's the biggest load of bull I have heard in a long time. How is the government saying this is our offer (the same offer) over and over again collective bargaining?

By forcing this contract onto teachers this is just the beginning. Every public employee will be under attack now. No more negotiations. Take what we offer or else its going to be forced on you anyways.

Sounds like a good plan to me wouldn't you say?

Also why the attack on teachers? Did you have a "bad" teacher when you were a student?

Do you hear teachers crying about their salaries? Because I don't. I hear them saying this is about the process involved. This is about being able to come to an agreement mutually and not being forced into a contract.
1/3/2013 10:09:11 PM
Escroft says:
I'll tell you why they kept saying "This is our offer." : Because you're too damn greedy. The offers you proposed are grossly unacceptable in today's age. Oh you have it so bad, your shiny brand new SUV's, minivans, cars, trucks, boats, paid vacations through your "sick days", your beautiful well-kept houses and lots and yards, all for 6 hours of teaching a student, oh oh! and plus a few extra hours of work at home. What you asked for when you tried to "bully" the Government, and that's what your version of "bargaining rights" are, is just a bullying tactic, the Government stood up to you. You remember all these ads stating for victims to stand up to your bullies? Well, the taxpayers and the Government have had enough of your bullying, and are making a stand. Now you are going through avenue upon avenue for vengeance. The time has come for you to take your licks like every other sector has done so far. Take your licks for awhile, and when things improve, THEN ask for more... POLITELY!
1/4/2013 11:03:51 AM
humnchuck says:
Escroft, your ranting might sound a whole lot more reasonable if it didn't always descend into envy of other people's belongings.
1/4/2013 11:35:00 AM
Escroft says:
And I am sick and tired of the teacher's unions always crying that they have it so bad when they have all this luxury. It's not jealousy, if that's what you're thinking. It's them crying about their pay frozen and their bullying tactics taken away, and their paid sick days docked, as though their pay just got cut by 60,000 dollars. With all these shiny beautiful things they possess, they are NOT as bad off as they think they believe they are.
1/4/2013 12:41:29 PM
humnchuck says:
But to share your opinion on the amount they are paid is one thing; how they, as individuals, chose to use it is another. It's nobody's business except theirs if they choose to buy a car, or SUV, or keep their yard nice, or give it to a charity, or store it in their sock drawers. Furthermore, logic would dictate that their income level also leads to more purchasing...in turn supporting businesses and the employment of others. Oh, and those "nice yards and houses"? They also pay property and other taxes just like you.
1/4/2013 12:55:09 PM
Escroft says:
Then they shouldn't be whining and complaining. I'm just sick of it. They're acting like the very children they nickname "brats". It's irritating the crap out of me.
1/4/2013 6:15:08 PM
Tiredofit says:
What kills me is they had months to deal with this prior to the bill, now they threaten the Liberals at election time. Do they really think the PC would give tem a better deal? I don't even the NDP would either, face it, you blew it.

1/3/2013 1:58:18 PM
Daxxis says:
Well, it's not exactly true that the only available option is through the ballot box.

So what if a strike is illegal? What would they do? Hire scabs?

A secondary point though: if the teachers did strike, ostensibly we're not paying them for that time off, would the government refund our tax dollars to the tune of the time the teachers were off?
1/3/2013 2:07:04 PM
conker2012 says:
Considering how many people have graduated with teaching degrees and cannot find work. I think we would do just fine if the teachers went on illegal strike.

Oh and do you know what happens if they illegally strike, termination without compensation and loss of benefits including employer paid pension..... so an illegal strike would be the best thing the teachers ever did for us tax payers.
1/3/2013 2:16:02 PM
Slyder says:
Good.

And if the strike is illegal the employer can discipline the worker. It would be like not showing up to work. You'd get fired.

But still not sure if I'd vote Liberal. Good intentions but drove up too much of a debt. Not very fiscally responsible. At least, however, they showed some character by following through with imposing these contracts.
1/3/2013 2:19:44 PM
Escroft says:
Give Pupatello a chance. She looks to have a good background. I wouldn't trust any of the other guys though.
1/4/2013 11:19:26 AM
vimeo says:
The 76,000 teachers have a long memory. I have two words:

Bob Rae

Where did that get you in the 80's? How ironic is their advertising campaign by saying it's not about the money as their wage contracts are settled.

No, it's about the right back us into the corner for future money. Good luck with that folks. You're in for a long future of disappointment if you think you're entitled to the same gravy train your parent's generation enjoyed. This is 2013, not 1985.
1/3/2013 2:23:08 PM
Tiredofit says:
And let's not forget how well Mike Harris treated them and all the other civil servants.

Like I said earlier, the teachers blew it, they have very little public support, their counter parts in the catholic system recognized and saw the writing on the wall and settled at the unions suggestion.

Many of us went to school just as long as them and some do make as much or more, however we all work a minimum of 50 weeks a year and don't complain about it, t least not like most teachers....... And that's usually a 8-10 hour day. Spoiled by the unions, nothing more.
1/3/2013 7:45:09 PM
CM Punk says:
Chambers can cry all she wants.
Plain and simple, there was plenty of time to reach an agreement as did the catholic board.

Despite it all, I am sure replacement teachers would be more then willing to fill in even if they made 50k a year.
And as for the comment of going to the ballot box when an election, you cast your votes.
You vote for either the NDP or PC and see what surprises you get after that.
1/3/2013 2:45:46 PM
youngintbay says:
How about the donkeys with the stop the wind turbines signs
1/3/2013 2:48:30 PM
eastender says:
Most teachers are making well over 50 dollars an hour, when you factor in time off for summer vacation xmas and easter. With benefits, such as sick leave, medical and dental, the cost goes even higher. Where can you get this type of pay in the private sector? Roller coasters dont go downhill all the time, they eventually have to go up, and thats pretty slow. Your not going to get sympathy from the public taxpayer because they are nowhere near your level of compensation and job security. Then again if you think you can do better in the privater sector, give it a try, and we'll see how you fare.
1/3/2013 2:51:03 PM
grayrabbit28 says:
I'm a teacher and I make just over $20 dollars an hour. I have mouths to feed and bills to pay and barely can. Teachers are all on different pay grids, the ones (if any) making the amount you state are very close to retirement. Teachers are 10 month employees but most opt to stretch their salaries over the year. Most full time workers receive benefits comparable to what teachers get. You must be a full time teacher to get any benefits or sick days. There are many of us working part time because there are not enough jobs to go around. Let me tell you, getting a job is not as easy as typing up a resume and getting an interview. You should complete the degrees required, pay for the courses needed and try to get a day of supply work then you can complain all you want. Last year I made a little over 30,000 - last time I checked that is just over the poverty line. Too many people taking from the tax base and not enough working. Are you one of them?
1/3/2013 11:46:53 PM
vimeo says:
So, how are you different from the rest of us?

Most people have to be full time to get benefits. The fact that you're part time is a supply and demand issue...it's not the fault of the governement. Do you think you're the only ones that have to work hard to get a good job?
1/4/2013 11:40:40 AM
grayrabbit28 says:
I'm not saying I'm any different. That's the point. I was a permanent teacher but my job was cut because of government funding and allowing the cap sizes to swell. There are many others who have lost their jobs due to government and board office issues and oversights. I'm just telling it like it is and doing what I can to survive just like you. At least I'm not rude and don't wish hardships on others who work different careers. I have a large family and a wide circle of friends who have all obtained their jobs without having to go through what I and many others teachers have had to go through.
1/4/2013 8:22:31 PM
Murray Copperbottom says:
I don't believe an election would change anything. People forget that the PCs voted in support of Bill-115, it passing a third reading with 82 yays to 15 nays()

The Assembly transcripts of the Bill paint a pretty good picture of how everything went down and gives everyone enough information to create an informed opinion.
1/3/2013 3:03:10 PM
yqtyqt says:
Both sides in this dispute deserve the worst possible outcome. The governing liberals for their incompetence and the teachers union for their greed. It IS all about the money. The province is broke and the teachers still want their entitlements. Unfortunately the students are the victims. If you believe that this is about the teachers rights, you're a fool.

Dalton, together with his local flunkies Mikey and Billie, gave these greedy employees everything they wanted in return for their votes. When the wheels came off, Dalton "and Dwight, and Chris Bentley and a flock of liberal followers quit. Just in time to see the financial Titanic hit bottom.

This generation of voters owe a huge apology to our students and future generations for voting in favour of the teachers unions and the "working families coaliton". It will put us behind for the next 25 years

....Sooner or later you have to pay the price for fiscal irresponsibility. You reap what you sow taxpayers. Its time to pay up
1/3/2013 3:17:18 PM
lori says:
YQT, there were several media reports a month ago from newspapers in Ontario about the government and excessive debt levels, spending too much, excessive deficits. The reports suggested controlling spending and to get the books balanced.

These reports were speaking of the Government of Canada, and the record of the conservatives.

Now, unlike you with the conservatives, I won't claim that everything Liberal has been great. I will say again that this Liberal gov't has been better for our region than any other gov't from any party in 50 years. Feel free to disagree without ever telling us what gov't has been better. As for this issue itself, the gov't did give the teachers too much money and they were wrong in how they went about this freeze, but they did the right thing in freezing teacher wages and clawing back some of the gold perks.
You and I can even agree that this is about money. This union needs to go. union members should be embaressed but their actions and their leaders.
1/3/2013 9:53:41 PM
yqtyqt says:
Well i might agree with you finally on several points. The Liberals have given away far too much money to the teachers. Agreed. This dispute is only about money. Agreed. The Liberal government went about this freeze and elimination of perks wrong. For the most part I agree - they should have done this years ago LONG BEFORE THE LAST ELECTION! But then again, you won't agree that the delay in their austerity program was solely to get re-elected.

The union needs to understand that Ontarians are taxed to the max. Agreed. This is all about fiscal irresponsibility and wasting money on vote grabbing schemes and failures. ie. Ornge, cancelling power plants, ehealth, lotoscams.

If you're going to tell the readers that the Libs have been great custodians of our tax dollars, you're loony. They have been the worst of the worst when it comes to careless spending. All over the province, icluding thunder bay.
1/4/2013 11:37:39 AM
lori says:
but yqt, you ignore the exact same thing at the federal level. High debt, high deficits, wasted spending. You are free to criticize the Liberals as you have done every posting but at least be fair and admit the conservatives are no better.

I have never once said I agree with the deficit spending. I have repeatedly stated I hate deficits and debt, but I have always stated this..

Ottawa is way over spending. Nickles are coming here

Toronto is way over spending, billions are coming here. 5% unemployment rate here for DEC. Lowest in Ontario. That is not by accident. People can't keep ignoring the countless good things the Liberals have done for us.

Sure, it is with borrowed money, I admit that, but Ottawa is borrowing as much, we have to pay our share of that and we are getting nothing for it.

As I keep saying, no two MPP's have done as much as these guys for us in 50years. You don't have to like them but it doesn't change the accuracy of that statement.
1/4/2013 2:46:38 PM
jonthunder says:
The Liberals will get killed in the next election. The electorate they disenfranchised was theirs, Hudak and the Conservatives will gain the teacher-bashers, they always were conservative. The teachers agreed to a wage freeze, but not their right to strike, and the right to take away banked sick days without some negotiation. The government legislated cutbacks on teachers and once done they think they can repeal the draconian legislation and everything will be hunk-dory, and the constitutional challenge will disappear - do they now wipe out consitutional and legal rights as well??? No union member would ever want to support an Ontario Liberal again; they lie, just as they did with First Nations and the Far North Act - they said they would not pass it if First Nations did not support it - then McGuinty just said "to bad, we have listened long enough, it is now law". Never, ever trust a dishonourable liberal.
1/3/2013 3:22:25 PM
gusto says:
And you think the Conservatives or the NDP will be any different. Things will be much worse for the teachers (and probably most other civil servants) under Hudak, and the tax and spend NDP couldn't punch their way out of a wet paper bag, much less lead the province out of recession.
1/3/2013 4:15:06 PM
trevor99 says:
for eons we have heard about the extra time teachers put in for coaching etc that justifies the shorter work day. It ignores the larger group of teachers who do not donate this time, but now that this time is no longer being given to kids, did they take a pay cut.

AT the top end, teachers make about 90 grand a year, for under 200 teaching days and every summer off. 8 weeks of time off from work in the prime vacation time of the year. Ask anyone if they would like every summer off.

Chambers can yell and scream all she wants but her members cannot support the conservatives because that will be far worse for her members so they only place to put their vote is with the NDP.

Now, if the NDP don't get to be gov't, then you wasted votes, alienated the other two parties and did nothing for your members except ensure they will get even less.
Have at er Ellen, nothing would make most of Ontario happier than seeing teachers getting far less for what they do. I wish you the best of luck
1/3/2013 4:08:39 PM
humnchuck says:
I'm not sure that the teachers are saying extra coaching etc. justifies a shorter work day; if anything, the suggestion seems to have been that they have other preparation tasks (marking, planning, etc.) extend beyond the hours in which they are with students.

As far as the number of teaching days goes, Ontario has among the longest school years (194 days) of anywhere. Most places in the U.S. are in the 180 day range, from what I've read. Lengthening the school year is certainly possible, but you're then going to run into some major infrastructure and maintenance costs to air condition schools across the province to offset the 30c+ temps in many places in summer. There's a board near London that tried a year-round schooling model (same number of days, but staggered start for different groups of students) a few years ago; not sure how well that worked.

Maybe an outcome of all of this might be to at least give good teachers credit for the great jobs that they do?
1/3/2013 4:55:25 PM
bttnk says:
Trevor, your post completely ignores reality. I'll introduce you to it. Teachers are not paid during the summer. They get paid for 10 months of work. You mention that teachers get paid 90,000 at the top end. Ok, is that unreasonable? I don't believe it is. Can you name another profession that you don't make more than $90K after 15 years when you have a graduate degree? I suspect you would find that most graduate degree holding professionals make far more than that after 15 years.

Once again, I will make my position clear. The teachers union needs to be far more realistic about wages and benefits and the government needs to stop trying to tear down unions making strikes illegal. If you are a union member (I am not) they are coming for you next.
1/4/2013 9:04:15 AM
trevor99 says:
you must be joking. Teachers are not paid in the summer??? They are not working. People don't usually get paid for not working. I love this line from teachers. Well, we really are only getting paid for 10 months but they spread the cheques over 12 months so that means we can't collect unemployment insurance.
Average 6 hours a day. 30 hours per week. 4 weeks a month times 10 months = 1200 hours. Give them 1500 hours for some extra weeks. Do the math. That is over $70 an hour. Find me jobs that pay that much for going to basket weaving 101 at teachers college. Look there are great teachers but like any other job there are lousy ones but if they are not happy taking zero for two years then leave. They got over 3% per year for the last 8 years and it still wasn't enough for these folks. Then it is time to let the thousands of unemployed teachers have their turn, but stop telling us its for the kids and the most common reaction when their is a dispute is cancelling stuff for kids. Enough
1/4/2013 11:53:32 PM
peas08 says:
So whats the point of having a union if the gov't just over rules everything? Whats next? I hope they get all their union dues back. All the gov't does is bully people to get what they want. Everyone goes on and on about the benefits teachers have etc. If you wanted to be one than you could have too. I think it is unfair that the gov't decides their future.
1/3/2013 4:12:14 PM
animiki says:
Have to admit, I'm getting little tired of that "argument" i.e. if you're so envious, you should have become a teacher. First of all, not everyone can be teachers, because...well, hopefully, it's obvious why not. Secondly, that's hardly the point; the province and its taxpayers simply can't afford what the teachers (and, yes, various other PS unions) seem to expect as their "due". WHY the province is broke is a critical, but entirely separate issue. The fact is, we are, and there you go. The PS unions had better get used to this unpleasant reality. Finally, the teachers simply haven't made their case in any compelling way. Essentially, they've said, Bill 115 and forced contracts is bad, because it's bad. They've failed to resonate with the vastly un-unionized workforce in the province, so they haven't really EARNED the public's sympathy.
1/3/2013 6:53:07 PM
dave78 says:
"Have to admit, I'm getting little tired of that "argument" i.e. if you're so envious, you should have become a teacher."

Me too. It's truly a hypocritcal position to take. It seems teachers feel they are permitted to voice their opinions regarding the pro's and cons of their occupation but, if anyone else does the same, teachers tell them that they should have chosen a different career path if teaching is so appealing.

Perhaps some of these Teachers should heed the advice they are only too quick to give others: If your chosen occupation is not as rewarding as you'd hoped it would be, it's never too late to explore other career opportunities. There is a long list of qualified folks who'd be only too glad to take your place.
1/4/2013 1:56:16 PM
Reignmaker says:
"If you wanted to be one than you could have too."

Except those precious teachers are the most nepotistic people in the free world who pull ranks against any outsiders at every given chance. Simply put, we can no longer afford these benefits that they are given. If everyone else has to give up things so that the deficit can be worked on, what right do the richest teachers in the world have to refuse?
1/3/2013 8:50:54 PM
brooky says:
There is no point I guess. Why should they get thier union dues back when they pay them to themselves. They failed and the majority of taxpayers are happy. The only thing that the Libs did right this term is to put the teachers in their place.
1/3/2013 9:14:14 PM
jonthunder says:
Yes, I will concede the Liberals did lead us out of a recession; they led us right into a public depression. The education issues are only one small part of the Liberal governance disaster; read the news for an endless list of all their screw-ups. We had a good education system - now we have a MESS.
1/3/2013 5:02:14 PM
jonthunder says:
Yes, I will concede the Liberals did lead us out of a recession; they led us right into a public depression. The education issues are only one small part of the Liberal governance disaster; read the news for an endless list of all their screw-ups. We had a good education system - now we have a MESS.
1/3/2013 5:09:06 PM
Tom Sanderson says:
Communism at its best. I can't wait to hear all the whining when the government starts to dictate what the general population can do and when they can do it. You had better start looking after your health because Canada is heading for a pay per use system just like our neighbours in the USA. There will be no more freebies. Oh and wait until they start restricting your internet access and start reading your email.
1/3/2013 5:19:08 PM
loring says:
why not just make teachers an essential service stops striking but still allows for collective bargaining
1/3/2013 6:02:50 PM
bobguy says:
Peas08 you have hit the nail on the head. It the teachers or any union for that matter get decent deals, job security, benefits and a better standard if living than most other citizens then the unions constituents will start asking why they are funding their unions so much. This may not be so much about teachers pay than unions feeling of self worth.
1/3/2013 11:49:58 PM
oldtimerqt says:
Live with it .... Other unions have.. With no recourse....to fight back..
Its better than receiving a registered letter and forced to work with no options....or go to jail

1/4/2013 2:20:45 AM
ibrando says:
I never ever looked at the teaching profession as something I wanted to do. I do know some excellent dedicated teachers that absolutely earn their compensation. That being said I have run into far more individuals whose primary motivation to become a teacher was the attractive pay & benefits package. Sad. As for Ellen, throw your support behind one of the other two parties and see how well that works out.
1/4/2013 8:59:30 AM
Cm Punk says:
Actually BTTNK, Trevor is right.
And teachers cap at 97k a year, and yes, that salary is spread over 26 pay dates so they do get paid over the summer, march break and xmas break.
1/4/2013 10:53:25 AM
humnchuck says:
97k? A quick look around the public board's website shows that their grid tops out at $92k after 11 years experience and in the A4 category, which I believe requires a Master's degree or specialist additional qualifications.

Their pay dates may be spread out over the entire calendar year, but they may still technically be 10 month employees. At one time teachers were not paid in July and August.
1/4/2013 11:42:16 AM
Slyder says:
Who cares if they have 26 pay dates? Look at the hourly wage. They are being paid like a full time employee. They work 195 days a year have 240 minutes of teraching time and 40 minutes on planning time. Yes... less then 5 hours. Top A4 qualifications are not super difficult to get. 50% of the teaching force is topped out. You defiantly don't need a masters degree, and ongoing training is part of most any profession/trade in order to advance.

So even after 10 years if all these other professions that make $92k a year. (Nurses, engineers, foresters, etc please pipe up and let us know... that this is not the case)...

$92k/39 weeks working a year vesus $92k/46-48 weeks working a year. And that's wage, not pension and benfits which are also the best in Canada... $$$$$



Teachers make a ton more... a ton. Another thing... have a teach quit their job.. and find the same compensation and holidays elsewhere. They won't. It's a huge benefit that is not deducted.
1/4/2013 2:04:12 PM
TBDR says:
Its a good thing there are so many labour negotiations experts on here or I'd have been confused. I'm just amazed that you're also political specialists, economic advisers, policing consultants and urban developers at the same time. You must have all gone to school for a long time!
1/4/2013 10:54:19 AM
yqtyqt says:
And you.....

You know more than the those who are posting their frustrations with both sides to this dispute.

Perhaps many of them have gone to school for a long time. Or others may work in finance, labour relations etc.

Do tell..what makes you so intelligent that you can dismiss this comments of posters and taxpayers on this article.

If you have superior intelligence that can clarify your comments, please elaborate on them an tell us why we should pay any degree of respect for your comments.
1/4/2013 11:43:47 AM
animiki says:
So one must be some sort of "expert" to have an opinion? Merely being a taxpayer isn't sufficient? Or could it be a sign of some healthy democracy in action that people are willing to express their opinions? And could it be an even healthier expression of democracy to respond to those opinions with countering ones, or even better, compelling counter-arguments, backed up with facts and hard data?

For example, I have several times now raised the fact that the teachers have failed to connect with the public in a meaningful way, because they've failed to demonstrate exactly HOW Bill 115 is bad for a largely un-unionized, heavily taxed workforce. "It's bad because we say so", or "It's bad because it's bad" just doesn't work. WHY is it bad? HOW is it bad? I'm a self-employed small business owner. CONVINCE me. Don't just say, you should be supporting us without telling me WHY.
1/4/2013 11:46:38 AM
gusto says:
What I have not heard from a single teacher, union official or School Board member is a single constructive solution to Ontario's balloning debt and the huge roll that runaway education spending has played here.
I fully support our teachers and I recognize the fact that they are highly trained individuals who do a very difficult and extremely important job, however, I do not support a system of automatic pay raises and sick time payouts that are not at all related to job performance. This just breeds mediocrity and entitlement...
1/4/2013 6:11:48 PM
humnchuck says:
Any suggestions as to how you would pay teachers based on job performance?
1/5/2013 8:53:46 AM
dave78 says:
I can understand why Teachers would be upset over the fact that their right to bargain collectively has been taken from them. Wouldn't it be a great PR move for the Teacher's Union to tell the public that, no matter what their fight with the government is, their members will not take out their frustration on the students by withdrawing from voluntary activities. Rather the Teachers are already threatening a "day of protest" and many Teachers have said that they will continue to "work to rule". I know it is not intended but, no matter how you look at it, cancelling sports events, dances, etc. punishes the only innocent party in all of this. The union should pursue their concerns in in the courts and with the Labour Relations Board. They'd have my full support if they did. They are taking their frustrations out on the wrong party in my opinion and I suspect they will continue to lose public support because of it.
1/4/2013 12:02:10 PM
itmatters says:
We agree. It is a shame when the Public Board kids are friends with the Catholic Board kids and they hear how the Catholic Board is continuing to play basketball and has some tournaments lined up. They are told how the cheerleading is starting up next week for the Catholic Board but not the Public Board. These kids just want to participate in school sports. We have been informed also that the Public Board will continue sanctions because this is their only bargaining tool. Again at the expense of our children. Shame.
1/4/2013 1:09:13 PM
Concerned Taxpayer says:
Make teachers an essential service like police and fire fighters. Have them work from 8 to 5 with an hour for lunch and 2 coffee breaks, then they wouldn't have to take work home. Give then 2 to 3 weeks holidays and let them take them when convenient for management and teacher. Give then 2 days off at xmas and 1 day off at easter. Let them contribute to a RRSP and find out how big their pention will be, and welcome them to the real world.
1/4/2013 2:39:54 PM
therealreason says:
Animiki I'll tell you why it's bad. And no, i'm not a teacher. In a country like Canada, many "essential services" are public sector jobs. In the public sector, tax payers see where "their" dollars are going and can get frustrated by this. In the private sector, one cannot see, and does not have the right to see, where all of one's dollars are going. Therefore they get less frustrated. With no union, and a bunch of frustrated, angry "tax" payers, the workers end up getting the very short end of the stick - and because these jobs are run by the government, you have no alternative employment options to match your training. As an example, where does a Postal Person, Fireman, Paramedic, Teacher, or many other workers work if not for the province? (without getting another degree). In the private sector, YOU are able to control your own income through innovation, advertising, etc. IF the economy is poor, you may do poorly. But when the economy is strong, you will do very well
1/4/2013 2:55:48 PM
animiki says:
You're making a case for why public sector workers may be frustrated i.e. their wages and benefits are subject to public scrutiny...but, so what? Those wages and benefits are derived from the taxpayers, and there IS a direct analogy in the private sector. Corporations generally derive their revenue from investors and shareholders, who expect a return on that investment if/when the company is profitable. Such corporations are legally-bound to provide financial and other information to their shareholders. So while I agree that this may be WHY some teachers (in this case) are frustrated, that doesn't make it a reasonable cause.

As for getting other jobs...well, first, the public sector generally has termination provisions far more generous than those in the private sector. Secondly, I wasn't aware that job LOSSES were part of the current concern. So, again, what is is about Bill 115 that is so bad for the taxpaying public?
1/5/2013 1:08:55 PM
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